Carl Zha is back and I try to explain to him the hysteria of the accusations by the CSIS leaker in Canada of Chinese electoral interference. He can’t find a word of it in Chinese media which leads to the horrible possibility that Canada doesn’t matter very much to China. I try to explain to him what has been going on in the Canadian media and he reminds us that Australia has been concocting the same story – anonymous intelligence sources using the media to create a scandal around supposed Chinese electoral interference – since 2017. It’s hard to take seriously, so we don’t.